The Ruckers Forum

Forum » Rugby » General Stuff » Springbok outside centre . . .
Login to reply
 
 
 
7158 Topic: Springbok outside centre . . .
Rooinek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1487
Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 10:35:18
A lot has been written in recent weeks about who should or shouldn't be wearing the Springbok #13 jersey and up until now I've reserved my judgement because I wanted to see how Jaque Fourie performed.

Before I go any further, note that I have been quite outspoken about players like JP Pietersen and Jaque Fourie walking straight back into the Springbok side after playing touch rugby in Japan and I've gone even further and said never mind just Japan, no overseas-based players should be considered for the Springbok team and the only players up for selection should be those who took part in that season's S15 or Currie Cup.

Okay, now that I've cleared that up, I saw very little to change my mind on Saturday. I thought Jaque Fourie looked pretty ordinary. There were moments when he showed a bit of the old spark but in general he looked rusty, confused and about 5m off the pace of the game. I read a newspaper article this morning where Meyer is quoted as saying he was happy with Fourie's performance which is a bit of a worry because all that Fourie (and JP) proved was that there's a huge gap between Japanese club rugby and the S15 or the CC.

So where to now? Looks like Meyer is going to stick with Jaque but what are the other options? I know there are some people who refuse to give up on JJ Engelbrecht but I'm afraid while he does offer some attacking pace, his defence is just not up to test standard and you have to go back to the pathetic arm-flapping "defence" of Marius Joubert to find a worse defender in the Springbok #13 jersey.

I think the guy who deserves a shot now is Jan Serfontein and I don't really mind if that is in the more unfamiliar #13 jersey or in the #12 jersey with Jean moving to outside, although I'd prefer the former, especially considering JdV's current form.

Yes, I know Serfontein has had one or two opportunities which he didn't exactly grab with both hands but he's also been a bit unlucky with injuries and I think we've seen enough of this youngster to know that he deserves an extended run in the Springbok team to show what he can do at this level.

JP and Jaque should go back and play in the 2014 S15 if they're serious about playing in the next RWC.


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 11:02:49
 Serfontein just needs an extended run..Meyer needs to tell him, the next 3 test matches are yours. You will play 240 mins and its up to you to show you are up to it. Its tough for him to keep getting 10 mins or so and expect him to show his worth. He is so desperate to touch the ball that he tries too hard..

Show some confidence in him and i reckon he will settle in nicely. The confidence in JJ is misplaced and wasted on him. Give Serfontein that confidence and faith in him and i bet he will show JJ up.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 11:02:54

Rooinek

 

My problem is that Meyer has to justify hiss selection of player like JP and Fourie in the media.   Both had very poor games on Saturday and if we look at the other foreign - based players who did not play in Super 15 this year - there was only  one who showed anything over the past year and that was Louw.   The rest were all disappointing.  

 

In essence I agree with you about foreign-based players.  They leave our shores - get fat and unfit - and end up like Francois Steyn and  most of the others.   Meyer already should have found out that in the main they flop as a result.    I was even shocked by the bulking stomach when I saw Bakkies on TV on Saturday.

 

It will take Meyer a while to cotton on that he is  wrong about the so-called legends playing in Europe and Japan - so the plague would remain with us for a while yet.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 14:28:36

Rooi on what do you base your take on JJ being so poor defensively this year given his defensive stats read no better or worse than his centre partner Jean?

 

His defensive record against NZ in two tests was better than most.......so I don't really get what the issue is with his defence.

 

 

Chances are it was the two big misses in the year, his miss on Bosch and Barrett.......but in both instances he was the outside defender and the responsibility to make the tackle primarily lay with the inside defender.......so circumstances dictated that he was never in a good position to make the tackles.

 

 

Those tackles apart, when else has JJ failed in test matches. JJ offers so much more than any other prospect in SA and that is purely down to his pace and feet. Serfontein is our future at 13, he does not have the sheer pace which gives a 13 the edge.

 

 

Have to disagree with you on your take on JJ's defence, its blighted by two misses I suspect......but the stats tell us JJ has been solid all year


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 14:29:12
 
Jaque Fourie is there cause Meyer firstly wanted to see what the lad had to offer and secondly ... JJ sucks.

Serfontein shoulda been given a run during the mid year tour of Scotland, Italy and Samoa. He is the future. A definite talent of that there is no doubt.  

I will be most surprised to see Serfontein get a run at all. 





Rooinek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1487
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 14:39:06
"Rooi on what do you base your take on JJ being so poor defensively this year given his defensive stats read no better or worse than his centre partner Jean?"

Dave, I'm not as fixated on stats as some of you guys, I go on what I see with my own eyes. To me, JJ's tackling technique is poor and he's almost always upright when making a tackle. Can't say I really noticed his poor defence in the S15 but I have noticed it in just about every test he's played this year.

Not sure if you made a typo but you seem to be saying Jan Serfontein is our future #13 even though he's not fast enough to be a #13? He looks plenty quick to me. Worth a try to play him at #13.


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 14:58:49
 
Wow ...!!!!!

What's with the sudden change, Stupid?

From a snarling Rottweiler to a timid little poodle. All excited about a possible belly scratch.

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahaaaa.

The fucker's not only a lard ass retard but a sniveling coward as well.

Guess who's the alpha male in that pack?

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaa!!!!

Hilarious stuff!!!!

"Here boy ... here boy ... !!!!"




The_Truth

Status: Baby Bok
Posts: 158
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 15:01:28
" Chances are it was the two big misses in the year, his miss on Bosch and Barrett.......but in both instances he was the outside defender and the responsibility to make the tackle primarily lay with the inside defender.......so circumstances dictated that he was never in a good position to make the tackles."

What utter bullshit. If a player runs straight into your channel, you are supposed to make the tackle. One of the most basic things of defence. Protect your channel!

But in the Barrett case I still don't blame JJ specifically. Jean opened the option for Barrett by shooting up too far and exposing a gap between two defenders. The fact is that Jean initially left his channel exposed and others had had to scramble to try and close the gap. What was disappointing about the JJ attempt was that he had both hands on Barrett, but allowed him to slip through.


Just_win

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 5018
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 15:05:37
 Don't you just love all this talk of alpha males? The fact is the wolf pack is lead by the alpha female , lol


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 11, 2013, 15:08:55
 
Yeah right ... in your neck of the woods perhaps.



Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 00:23:36
 The Truth you clearly know fuck all about rugby.......Barrett was attacking space......the channel between Morne and JJ.......the inside defender was Morne, JJ was covering wide......when Morne missed Barrett, JJ had to re adjust and his only option was to go high......he missed him as he never had time to align and effect a proper tackle......its that simple


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 00:33:28
Rooi......I am with you on stats as they dont provide context......but what stats do tell you broadly is that you either made the tackle or missed it. JJ's defensive stats for the year are pretty much on par with Jean's with number of tackles made and missed.......so hence me struggling with this perceived idea that he is defensively poor.


I only recall two instances when he was upright in trying to make a tackle and that was his two misses against Bosch and Barrett.......but circumstances dictated that because inside defenders had missed the ball carrier, he was left clutching at straws as it were and was never in a position to go low.


I am not saying JJ is a bone crushing defender, but he is no worse than Jean......the stats tell us that.


I think that the perception that he goes high and is a poor defenders stems from those two well documented misses I mention above.


His attacking attributes far outweigh the perceived defensive frailties.........when he starts missing one on one tackles, we then should have an issue with the guy. 


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7799
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 01:30:59
Only thing is, I can't...ever...remember him going low. Sometimes it's essential. 


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 01:57:31
I can say the same of Jean, Serfontein, Morne, Lambie and the likes........I'm sure they all go low just like JJ does......but can we recall specific tackles?


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:10:55


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:12:06


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:13:36
 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:14:30


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:15:11
 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:16:10
 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:18:15
 JJ usually tackles high. 
This is why he falls off players like the Bosch Tackle when he had his arms around him but still missed the tackle.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:22:57
Ah good one Sharktwat......first one, Read is already on his way down


Second one provides no context


Third one, he is still in a position to go low.....2 or 3 frames later would have told us


Forth says nothing


Fifth he is holding up the attacker with the help of Beast


Sixth he is about to assist a team mate who has already effected the tackle


Try again loser




Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:25:55
Crap, Bosch was Jannie's man, the inside defender, JJ was covering wide, had to re adjust when he realised Jannie had no chance, could only go high, was off balance and in the end hardly got a hand on Bosch.


Had JJ been the inside defender Bosch would never have scored. Bosch attacked the Jannie's outside, Jannie had no chance


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 02:26:23
Crap, Bosch was Jannie's man, the inside defender, JJ was covering wide, had to re adjust when he realised Jannie had no chance, could only go high, was off balance and in the end hardly got a hand on Bosch.


Had JJ been the inside defender Bosch would never have scored. Bosch attacked the Jannie's outside, Jannie had no chance


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 03:03:49

 I hate those lines of stats Mike loves to put up..They show fuck all! Watch the games/players with your eyes and you can see.

 

I have shown Dave all these pics before Sharkbok. To him though, seein means nothing and stats are to be believed.

 

He speaks about Barrett attacking space. Yeah Dave, because players always close their eyes, hug the ball and brace for contact in space..Clown!! The "space" was JJ.. Jean had nothing to do with the tackle. He went for the big play. If it paid off, he is under the posts and we win. If it doesn't, JJ tackles Barrett. Unfortunately it didnt come off and JJ didnt do his bit! Fair and square miss tackle by a player with shit technique..It will happen more and more to JJ..Just you watch...


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 06:42:48

Boklogic

 

I never base my arguments on stats - but what really happen in tests - and only use stats sometimes to confirm that what I said was correct.   I differ from Saffex about Engelbrecht and do not think he is that wonderful a 13 - neither in defence nor in attack.

 

After watching all games in Super 15 this year and the test on Saturday I am convinced that the position should in fact be still regarded as being wide open, provided that there is no place for two players in that position -

 

*   the disgustingly poor De Jongh - whose defence is the weakest I have seen from an outside center for any franchise team in SA; and

 

*  the touch rugby specialist Fourie - whose performance on Saturday was desperately poor and whose defence is worse than anything imaginable - even worse than he defence of Engelbrecht - and who has the pace of a slow carthorse. 

 

Lets hope that the answer is to be provided in Super 15 next year - at this stage we are dealing with comparing the hopeless with each other and still getting nowhere in finding a solution.     


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7799
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 07:07:16

Here he goes so high, he is about to sail over Jaws 

 

Retallick scores first try for All Blacks against Springboks


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 09:01:13
 Great technique..Text book stuff...



Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 09:02:32
 Oopsie, standing straight up again!



Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 09:08:19
 ag nee JJ!!!







Love the last one..Lealifano loves a good back tickle


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 10:31:09
Ag please! JJ may never be the greatest defender but he can become an adequate one. Who can deny his defence has improved since moving to center. Then as Snapster says what about his other real gifts - real gas and good feet etc. 
JJ will be even better next year.
As for the pics many of them show nothing in the one immediately above re Lealifano if he had gone low he would have banged heads with Alberts was it.

JJ is potentially our best 13. Next thing we will have the oaks quoting ou saSUE who would love JJ to be left out of the Boks!

Stick with it snapster its far too early to conclude that JJ can't and will never be able to defend.

Lastly if our entire Bok squad got contracts overseas should we only pick local players. Well of course not unless we want to commit suicide. Get the principle right. No coach should ever be put in the position where he cannot pick what he thinks is the best side. His job is on the line and so is our standing in world rugby. 
Please rooitwit no more babbling on about this issue as its obvious that we must in principle pick our best side. 
I see Ludik is off to a second division French club.








clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 14:21:01

Beeno

 

That photo of the Leali'ifano tackle was not by Alberts - reason Alberts never wears a scrum cap.  It was likely by Kruger or Van der Merwe - but much more likely Kruger - since he always wears a white scrumcap.   

 

I am also critical of Engelbrecht about his tackling technique - but do not lose sight of his positives as well.   Fossil brain and his fossil brain companion (Mozart and Clean cut) saw the negatives in Engelbrecht - over-empohasized them - but do not see the ample deficiencies of their new champion Fourie in both defence and attacking play.   Those two really needs  brain surgeons - but it may be a futile  exercise, since they may not find the brain in their brain cavities  - a microscope may just be of help. :D:D:D


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 14:42:44
 
Now now Mike ... that wasn't very nice.

Just cause Alberts showed you up as a bit of dummy doesn't mean we're at fault here.

So tell me ... when can we expect to see your official apology?

Come now, Mike ... we both know it's way overdue already ... so let's have it!!


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 15:19:50

Clean Cut

 

Sure I apologize to you by calling you a fossil brain - was not nice of me that one - since I basically do agree with you on the Engelbrecht case - and the nasty statement and  apology relates to the case under discussion only.

 

In the Alberts case - no apology is given.  It was never part of the item under discussion.  I differ from you on the player and I am not going to change my opinion on that one - you are entitled to you opinion as I am entitled  to mine - so lets agree we differ in that case.  No fossil brain issue in that case - just a difference in viewpoints.

 

I will not apologize to Mozart - like I did in the past - and then ended up with a most nasty attack on me by him - he is really  a fossil brain moron.       


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 15:45:14
 
I was kidding Mike!! Calling me a fossil brain doesn't offend me in the least. I've been called a lot worse ... ask Stupid!!

Besides I knew you didn't mean it that way.

You really are a strange man. Should learn to chill a bit.

Alberts does however deserve a heart felt apology from you.

I am very pleased to see he's been offered a contract as I'm sure you are too ... right? Of course that was always going to happen seeing he's such an absolute class act.



 


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 16:28:39

 Clean Cut

 

Sorry about the difference of opinion on Alberts - in my book he remains a slow prop masquerading as a loosie - very good in defence in traffic, but outside of that not a loosie's ass.  

 

A contract by SARU is an exercise in futility and is meaningless - remember previous contracts with ninnies like De Jongh - shows you what their contracts really entail.  I may change my opinion on Alberts if he is offered a foreign contract - but the clubs know something about player evaluation and they will NEVER offer Alberts a contract.  However, in the case of Kruger and Morne they also miss the boat insofar as player evaluation is concerned - so their identification is at times flawed.   However, when they NEVER offer a contract - it really show some really major problems with the player concerned.

 

No apologies to Alberts and the contract will not change my mind - he will never get my contract in fantasy team selection.  :D:D:D

 

  


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7799
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 16:48:12
I'm sure he is devastated 


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 19:27:33

Cleancut

 

After looking at the contracts news item there is one thing in evidence - we all know of the BEE issue - which resulted in contracts being signed with certain players irrespective of merit -  but there seems to be another requirement as well.

 

That requirement is being illustrated by Francois Steyn and Willem Alberts,   The fatter and the slower you are - the more likely is a SARU contract,   Steyn never had a decent match for 18 months and Alberts plays a badly reduced role in loosie play by performing  only one of the functions of a loosie - but the contracts  are signed.  


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 20:50:19

 Mike, I may be missing something there but where do you see the "white scrum cap?" I see the predominantly white ball and the players head behind the attackers back.

 

Beeno..Sure, lets not give up on JJ. He can sort his defence out. Ok, his defence is grand now. What are we gona do about his attack and lack of vision now? You see in the death against NZL he makes a half break then gooi's the ball forward in a brain explosion to a player already miles ahead of him. His instincts on attack are reactionary and not natural. He is not a natural Nonu, Smith (x2) or Dagg. Flair and skill do not come naturally to him and at this level, these players need natural flair. Thats what makes them better at 100kg's than the other 100's of thousands of guys that play the game in the country of the same weight. They are just that much quicker and look like they have more time on the ball. JJ fits in with the club stuff. His pace has been the only thing keeping him treading water thus far.

 

His defence right now upsets me much less than his non-creative brain.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 21:18:01

Boklogic

 

Sorry I apologize - my eyes  must have let me down.  However, I doubt whether it is in fact Alberts in any event - him tackling a backline player is rarer than hen's teeth.

 

Now lets get to Engelbrecht.   Here I have stated previously that Engelbrecht is devoid of ball sense.   Poor defence can be coached out of  players - but ball sense cannot be coached into one.  Lack of ball sense make him a one-dimensional player - relying only on speed - and that for any backline player is a problem.   Deficient ball sense entails instantaneous reading of the game and deciding on what to do that would be most beneficial for your team.     Engelbrecht just does not have that quality.

 

He is not the only backline player with that deficiency.   Morne is not a ball sense player either - he is robotic and play in accordance with instructions.  Take for instance the Ellis Park test.  Meyer told  Morne to stand flatter and pass the ball more frequently - basically aiming at the cases of turnovers and breakdown ball recovery.  The Boks got a turnover in their own 22 as the siren is about to go off.  Because it was a turnover he followed instructions to the T and passed the ball instead of making a relieving kick.   That type of thing shows lack of ability to read the game - and lack of ball sense.  As we know that lack of vision cost the Boks 7 points shortly after it happened.

 

Another ball sense deficient player is Francois Steyn.   His vision consists of one thing only - you try to run over you opponent using bodily strength and nothing else counts.

 

Although you would frequently found ball sense deficient players in international backlines - they will never be great international players - they will always be rated as average players.  A ball sense player uses his brain not his bodily strength to decide on best actions to do - and that is a more precious commodity in players.  

 

   


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 12, 2013, 21:18:02

Duplication - sorry


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 11:10:24
 
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahaaaa!!!!!

Mike!!! That's not very nice. Yes Fat Frans Steyn is a porker of note ... BUT the AWESOME ... the INCREDIBLE ... Willem Alberts is pure friggin muscle ... from head to toe .... now apologize you shit!!!



Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 11:23:13
 Clean Cut, I take it you think Frans Steyn is overweight and a porker of note..How does he rate next to Dave and his son though? ;-)


CleanCut

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1719
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 11:56:20
 
No friggin idea. Never seen the retards. Not senior nor junior. Wouldn't want to spoil my day.

I know of three posters on this board that would advise you better. Two of them completely biased though so I'd take whatever they have to say with a pinch of salt.






Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 20:47:40

 Well, I do know he was short and round and turned up in suspenders but no jacket to a club. He also has a ridiculous long hairdo and he does support the Boks so that is likely to be coloured green..I approached a police sketch artist and this is what he got:

 

 

 

 


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 23:12:13
What a load of shit as I pointed out those photo's tell us nothing......the few CHICKEN has added are an embarrassment to the dumb CHICKEN himself.......Spies is the main tackler, JJ assisting.


Etzebeth as high as JJ, lets give Etzebeth the boot shall we.......you dumb prick?


Good smother tackle on Savea......CHICKEN, do you know what a smother tackle is


Beast and JJ holding the player up, lets sack the Beast you dumb prick


Same tackle on Savea, different frame, love the way Jean is tackling a man high without the ball.......oops


JJ is not effecting the tackle on Lealifano you stupid plank.


But best of all, all these poor attempts blighting JJ's tackling credentials are photo's of him against the AB's.......the side he has played twice and made 12 tackles, missing 1........his stats against the AB's are better than Jean's this year.


Case rests your honour...............give CHICKEN some corn, poor stupid bastard


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 23:32:21

Cleancut

 

At least w agree on Fat Frans.   :D:D:D

 

Alberts - have you seen his gut bulging out over his shorts when they sing the National Anthem?   Gut the same size as Gurthro and that take some doing.  So no apology in his case. :P:P:P  


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 23:48:00

 Fat prick dave, smother tackle on Savea?? How so? Looks to me like Savea's arms are free to pop the ball off to any support runner. Great "smother" tackle..I think you need to learn what a smother tackle is.

 

His tackle with the Beast on Messam is a smother tackle. The ball can not be free'd up. You getting it now fatness?

 

Dave, one would think that your constant lashes at Jean to take the attention away from JJ would suggest that you are saying our captain and best back this year has actually not played better than JJ? Is this what you are saying? Are you saying JJ has been better than Jean this year?? Simple yes or no will do slob!

 

You are very right in your statement "JJ is not effecting the tackle on Lealifano!" That is true..JJ wouldn't know how to effect the tackle.

 

Never once did we say all the above tackles were missed tackles. We are drawing attention to his technique. A technique that will stop men but will also coast tries if you get it slightly wrong which JJ does. It is a much lower percentage technique than taking the legs. That is all we are exposing. His technique. Not his misses.

 

Etzebeth is miles away from Nonu. Nonu is almost standing on JJ's toes. How can Etzebeth go low? He is nowhere near the pace of Nonu or JJ which is why backs usually beat tight forwards. Etzebeth is scrambling, JJ is perfectly placed yet he chooses to stand straight up and hug the man (which Nonu might enjoy!) Dave, you would have really benefitted from playing the game when you had the chance. You would then see it as it actually is and not have this blurred perception.

 

Maybe if you were man enough to answer your phone instead of watching it ring, I could have brought you up to speed.

 

...and on that note your honour, I think no further action needs to be taken against this delusional critter. He has been schooled and that is sufficient for his crime of stupidity. I have no doubt he will be a repeat offender but we shall deal with each instance on its merits. Possibly next time we can enroll him in "Smallcock's school of rugby" and get him started on the entry level course of "Fat guys who know fuck all and clearly never played the game!" Give this man some corn and send him on his way sir!


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 13, 2013, 23:52:10
CHICKEN......I'll keep this short and sweet as you are too fucking dumb to waste much time on.


Provide a valid and informed counter to JJ's defensive stats against NZ this year in the two tests he played.


Tackles made 12, tackles missed 1..........take your time yellowbelly


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 00:04:09

 Tackles made 12...Tries scored 0...Points accrued for his team 0

Tackles missed 1... Turnovers conceded 1.... Tries leaked 2....Points given away 14

 

Most crucial stat: Rugby championships fucked up for SA - 1!!!

 

So you see Dave, stats can be determined anyway you want...JJ cost us 14 points in 1 game against the AB's..Running into trouble with no support and a brilliant attempt on Barrett. He never scored shit

 

Summary = defensive flop!

 

Answer my question fuck head...Is JJ better than Jean??


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 00:12:31
Are you saying the stats are lying? Did I ask about how many tried he scored etc, you ignorant twat, huh?

Now try again you plank........counter the defensive stats.............no matter how you try twist it, the fact remains.......he tackled 12 AB's and missed 1..............this against the best side in the world.


The stats are facts..........you either make a tackle or you miss a tackle.......he made 12 and missed 1


Now man up CHICKEN and answer the question with a straight forward answer.......no ducking and diving, deflection or squirming.......we know its your trade mark, hell you are still shitting in your pants over your lie about coming to beat me up on the 12th Dec........but just man up here and answer the question......birdbrain


Wow you really are bright, let me guess maths has never been a strength.......12 tackles made, 1 missed = defensive flop...........bwhaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7799
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 00:31:44

Actually I make it 21 points given away. In sequence we have the overrun of the set move which should have been successful, it was the perfect platform. Two the naive inside step away from all his support, followed by the easy take down by Nonu, followed by the Read strip, followed by the crushing half time try. Three the now infamous papier- mache tackle on Barrett to lose the RC.

 

 

Of course I could be wrong, maybe Morne would have missed the conversion...hahaha.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8496
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 00:34:32
 Wrong, he was not accountable for a single point and had an outstanding test


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7799
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 00:36:19
Oh...okay then. 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3408
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 01:15:29
 Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. One of Saffex's favourites cant be wrong. 


Boklogic

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 01:29:19

 David, answer the question put forth please.. I will highlight it for you because you seem to over look it..

 

Do you think JJ was better and more valuable to the Boks this year than Jean??

 

Simple question really. Yes or no...

Not accountable for a single point? We are not saying he was accountable for just a single point..It was 21 that he was accountable for fatness ;-)

So he was not accountable for Barrett's try?? Forget that question though and just answer the one highlighted in bold and underlined!


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11903
RE: Springbok outside centre . . .
November 14, 2013, 06:34:50

   Boklogic

 

As expected the Ellis Park test - like the Dunedin test - will never go away.   We get the prejudiced stupid attacking their counterparts about  what really went wrong.   The mythical assumptions are incredible and used to attack individual players.

 

To my mind it was a comedy or errors made by a number of players - like the Barrett try for example - all of De Villiers, Morne and Engelbrecht buggered up.  

 

If Engelbrecht did not overrun the ball and knocked it on a try would have been scored.   Maybe - or maybe not - but seeing that Morne should have realised that a pass will go awry -  should he not do what is unimaginable for him -  namely attack the gain line himself, instead  of making a pass that is almost certain to be knocked on?  Who to blame - obviously Engelbrecht - if you have it in for the guy already - but is Morne really not partly responsible?  

 

In the Messam second try case - should Morne not have kicked the ball into touch when the siren was about to go off?     OOPS Don't ask Naas Botha about that one - he already had a fit on TV - and a second reminder of that could be health threatening the poor bugger would have a seizure.

 

In the main it was a comedy of errors starting off by Kruger - cannot cover balls after kick-ins, Alberts' seriously flawed tackle attempt on Read - Morne's flawed tackle technique and robotic play - Engelbecht's flawed tackle technique and lack of ball sense.

 

The idea to blame only one player for the loss is not on.  Sure their are degrees of blame for poor decision making and  execution and one wonders who was the worst offender.  Morne's name came up in the case of every debacle - so he is likely to be first offender, followed by Alberts - who all on his own though clumsiness  buggered up badly before the Messam first try - and then there is Engelbrecht with his flawed tackle technique and lack of ball sense.  


Leave a reply:

You need to be logged in to leave a reply.
 
 

From The Sideline