The Ruckers Forum

Forum » Rugby » General Stuff » If I was Bok coach
Login to reply
 
 
 
5354 Topic: If I was Bok coach
Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7569
If I was Bok coach
June 27, 2013, 23:12:37

I'd make sure all the class youngsters based overseas, returned to play S15 rugby. I'd insist on selecting the five S15 sides and use the S15 as a trial. My five sides would be:

 

Stormers:

15. Jessie Kriel 14. v/d Heever 13. de Allende 12. Frans Venter 11. Habana 10. Jantjies 9. Groom 1. Kitshoff 2. Callie Visagie 3. Malherbe 4. Quinn Roux 5. Etzebeth 6. Kolisi 7. Elstadt 8. Vermeulen

 

Bulls:

15. Visser 14. Mapoe 13. JJ 12. Serfontein 11. Mjekevu 10. Pollard 9. Hougaard 1. Mellett 2. Chiliboy 3. Marcel v/d Merwe 4. Willemse 5. Jacques du Plessis 6. D.Potgieter 7. A.Botha 8. CJ Stander

 

Sharks:

15. Andries Coetzee 14. JP 13. Dries Swanepoel 12. Frans 11. Mvovo 10. Lambie 9. Reinach 1. Beast 2. Bismark 3. Mujati 4. Jandre Marais 5. Steph du Toit 6. Daniel 7. Rhodes 8. Coetzee

 

Cheetahs:

15. Willie 14. Rhule 13. Pat Howard 12. Rohan Janse v/Rensburg 11. Jordaan 10. Goosen 9. v/Zyl 1. Nkanyane 2. Strauss 3. Coenie 4. de Jager 5. Peet Marais 6. Brussouw 7. Labascagne 8. v/d Walt

 

Lions/Kings: 

15. SP Marais 14. Sergel Petersen 13. Taute 12. Tim Whitehead 11. Sithole 10. Catrakillis 9. Schrauder 1. Cayleb Oosthuizen 2. Cooper 3. Frik Kirsten 4. Bresler 5. Ruan Botha 6. Carr 7. Louw 8. Josh Strauss 

 

 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 2929
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:06:33

How would you make all the young players return to South Africa? 

They left to get more money and because they were not selected for the Boks. 

 

Even if you could guarantee them Springbok selection, how would you fit them all into the match day squad of 23 players which allready includes many of the top players in their positions in the country like Etzebeth, Willie LeRoux, Habana and co.

 

How could you insist on selecting the 5 SuperXV sides if you were the bok coach?

These are indepdent companies to SARU and they contract the players of their choosing.

The players themselves also choose who they sign contracts with.

 

The players and coaches also have their favourite positions like Jaco Taute who realises he was a failure at center, and everyone except his grandmother, pet dog and gold fish are aware that he wants to focus at fullback.

 

I am sure the players that you want to relocate from Durban and Capetown would be really happy that you insist they now live in Pretoria or Bloemfontein.

ha ha


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:10:13
Saffex

That would be some very credible teams and in the main I agree with you. However, I still have serious reservations about Jantjies and like Fouche a lot at flyhalf. I would rather have either Fouche or Pollard in the Stormers team.

As for Steyn and Hougaard - only if they get themselves back into form - what they delivered this year was just not good enough - but I know you differ from me in that case.

Not sure about Swanepoel though - why was he left out in the game against the All Blacks Under 20 team? Like Janse Van Rensburg a lot though.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:10:14
Saffex

That would be some very credible teams and in the main I agree with you. However, I still have serious reservations about Jantjies and like Fouche a lot at flyhalf. I would rather have either Fouche or Pollard in the Stormers team.

As for Steyn and Hougaard - only if they get themselves back into form - what they delivered this year was just not good enough - but I know you differ from me in that case.

Not sure about Swanepoel though - why was he left out in the game against the All Blacks Under 20 team? Like Janse Van Rensburg a lot though.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:14:13
Sharkbok

I must side with Saffex here - it is more a dream of his and mine and we know it is just not feasible - but is a nice theoretical exercise nevertheless.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7569
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:16:33

For a start its hardly real and secondly your take on Taute is a load of shit, just like I found you all wanting regarding JJ at 13, the same applies to Taute.

 

He was our best test 13 last year by some distance and has hardly had much time there. I am happy to see him play 13 or 15 and the only reason he wanted to be considered at 15 for the Stormers was because he was being realistic in that he wanted a starting spot and would not get one at centre with Jean and de Jongh.

 

Taute is a class act but you lot are too stupid to recognise that. I said the same of JJ, he proved me right, Taute will do the same


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7569
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:21:41

Dries Swanepoel is a class act, the reason he did not start against the Baby Blacks is because Theron is an idiot. Swanepoel's try against the French was the best try by a centre I saw all JWC. His only fault was that on one or two occassions he did all the good work and then failed to move the ball wide - he was trying to impress too much. He has a huge reputation. At school he was regarded as being better than his centre partner Serfontein.

 

Jantjies is pure class and I am not even going to rise to your childish takes on Frans and Hougaard


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 2929
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:25:35

 It is a fantasy team selection then. You could have marked the title accordingly.

 

With regards to young players, you do back all the young players so it is inevitable some are going to work out.

 

The others like Sithole just fade away and drop out of your fantasy squad selections, as soon as the next batch of new kids on the block show up the next year. 

 

As a coach, like Fantasy rugby you have a budget to select a squad of the best players, but unlike Fantast rugby - real players need minimum contracts like 3 years etc.

This limits the contracting of new young players, and only the better ones can be contracted as they are likely to become first choice players. 

 

p.s- I did realise that the squads were not entirely serious, just wanted to see if you would explode like you can sometimes do.

I threw in the Jaco Taute comment to stroke the flames, he he!


mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6452
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:28:16

I'm more of an O Driscoll admirer.  Id build a team of hard experienced buggers, who know the rules, don't panic and know how to win. Rugby is a hard game, not a frigging ballet.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7569
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:34:18

Sithole is only 21 and has loads of potential. Any team selections made by posters are fantasy teams......we have no sway with Meyer sadly.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:35:47
Mozart

Typically Mozart - he just can't forget the past and want to live in it. By the way O'Driscoll was really the poorest center last week in the Lions - Wallaby Test - and that is a fact. I can also remember the second and third tests against the All Blacks last year when he had atrocious games.

I think O'Driscoll is running on empty - with only his reputation keeping him in teams. Nowadays still play well on Club level - in the main equal to the CC level in SA - but he is no longer really of international standard.


mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6452
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:38:07

 Oom Maaik has a dream. Lawd help us.....here comes Lappies  and Jordaan....no officer Fruean never ran over , Jordaan, he slipped after making the tackle.....hehe.


Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7569
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:38:42

Yep Moz, you would select Jean at 12, I would select Serfontein, you would select Juandre Kruger at 5, I would select Steph du Toit............your way is the Meyer way. Until the Meyer way starts beating the Kiwi's on a regular basis, my calls for the better, fresher youngsters will prevail


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 00:53:47
Mozart

What a joke - you wrote about O'Driscoll and merely pointed out that O Driscoll stayed on well past his sell-by date. What has Jordaan got to do with that? He-he and add De Jongh to the he-he list as well. Also through in Fat Steenkamp and you have a pair.


mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6452
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 01:01:00

Sure I'd take O Driscoll at 34 over a bunch of kids who couldnt beat the Welsh U 20s....no Bok team comprised of non first line players has ever troubled Oz or N Z . You chaps are smoking something


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 2929
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 01:39:50

Springbok greats that go onto to get 50+ caps typically are first choice boks at a very young age.

 

Sithole is 23 and cant make the Sharks SuperXV squad.

 

Sibusiso Sithole Full name Sibusiso Camagu Thokozani Sithole Date of birth 14 June 1990 (age 23) Place of birth Queenstown, South Africa Height 1.82 m (5 ft 11 1?2 in) Weight 94 kg (14 st 11 lb) School Queen’s College Rugby union career Playing career Position Wing Provincial/State sides Years Club / team Caps (points) 2011- Natal Sharks 38 (80) correct as of 13 May 2013. Super Rugby Years Club / team Caps (points) 2013 - Sharks


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 02:03:48
Mozart

You are destroying your own argument very well. O'Driscoll is definitely not troubling NZ or Australia at all anymore - and nobody here was talking of the Springboks - only of Super 15 franchises,


mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6452
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 02:12:56

Oh sure Oom Maaik ....Warren Gatland is less perceptive than you. The fool chose Paul O. Connell as well....how the hell did he win the 6 Nations? You really are in cloud cuckoo land old chop.


mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6452
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 02:13:06

Oh sure Oom Maaik ....Warren Gatland is less perceptive than you. The fool chose Paul O. Connell as well....how the hell did he win the 6 Nations? You really are in cloud cuckoo land old chop.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 08:40:55
Mozart

So no more O'Drsicoll - now we are onto O'Connell - who next?


bluebok

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1124
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 09:49:24
There is one way and one way only to do national team selections. Get a core of established players, experienced or otherwise, and build the team around them. You bring in young players and see if they can cut it at national level. If they can, keep them on, if not, forget them and move on. If one of the core players is injured, same thing, give a young up and coming player a chance, when the injured core player returns from injury, they fight it out for the team spot.

It also does not help to have a team of youngsters only, you need a balance between experienced guys and youth. If you have not got enough experience, the team will implode, I guarantee it. Too many experienced players and you land up with a vacuum like we had last year after the mass exodus. It is down to getting the right balance, as is just about everything in life.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10257
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 11:29:29
Bluebok

In essence I agree with your viewpoint - but I have a problem as well and that is experienced players should not be regarded as immune and I based on reputation. If their performances do not remain on an expected level there are serious question marks as to whether they should be kept on in the team.. As long as they perform on the required level - keep them in the team. If they don't they must go.


Spooony

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 718
RE: If I was Bok coach
June 28, 2013, 11:34:07

Saffex I was thinking to a similiar thing the other day. Your onto something but if I may suggest something do the following.

 

Remove the blokes who's abroad. Work with only the guys in the country. Now take the top 150 players or 75 if you just want to select starrting 15's and devide them into equally strength or equally sufficient in depth. Take where you have a talented youngster on the bench and switch him over to a team that have problems in that same position. 


Leave a reply:

You need to be logged in to leave a reply.
 
 

From The Sideline