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Sharkbok

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Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 02:51:32

 

Why do our coaches get it wrong?

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iol spt mar24 Kankowski

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A month into the 2013 Super Rugby competition, it is becoming clear that the more things change, the more they stay the same.Photo Steve Haag

 

A month into the 2013 Super Rugby competition, it is becoming clear that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

While the Australian franchises, particularly the rejuvenated ACT Brumbies, have led the way in terms of style and substance, the South African franchises – save for the Cheetahs – have contented themselves with a conservative approach.

And let’s not be fooled by yesterday’s romp against a Rebels side who are the weakest in the competition and who offered no opposition up front... this result changes nothing.

The Sharks, who were handed a brutal lesson in efficiency and execution by the

Brumbies in Durban last week, have arguably been the most underwhelming,

given the talent at their disposal.

“I’d have to say that they have probably been the

most disappointing, and they seem intent on playing

this direct, physical game that the Bulls used to play,

” former Bok wing Ray Mordt bemoaned this week.

Many in the stands at King’s Park have pointed

accusing fingers at the out-of-shape Frans Steyn,

suggesting that his direct approach at inside centre

has blunted the attacking instincts that marked the

Sharks’ run to last year’s final. Where they were

inventive and incisive with Tim Whitehead and

Paul Jordaan in midfield last year, they have

retreated back to the bashing routine this season.

Their lack of tries has not gone unnoticed.

“Look, they have some great runners in that team.

Paul Jordaan is a great little player, but how many

times has he touched the ball? The same can be said

of JP Pietersen out wide. You have to look to involve

that kind of player more, because they can change

games in an instant,” Mordt insisted.

“I’ve watched Frans Steyn since he was a youngster in

2007, when he was a brilliant, elusive runner.

But you look at him now, and he has become a thumper. He is clearly overweight, and he should have been told that he won’t play until he gets back in shape. This is a professional game,” Mordt maintained.

Former Sharks centre Pieter Muller, a regular observer at King’s Park, said it was a bit harsh to single out Steyn – who was benched for yesterday’s clash against the Rebels – for the Sharks’ deficiencies.

“I think that the whole team is just not attacking the line, and his strengths in that sense have been under-utilised. At the moment, the Sharks are playing a boring, predictable game, with slow ball which is forcing the backline to run from deep.”

Mordt believes that coaches in South Africa need to also take greater accountability for not developing smarter playing systems.

“I watched that game against the Sharks and Stormers a few weeks ago, and it was so boring. You have to ask the question, what are the coaches doing? The only South African team that is trying to play a modern brand of rugby is the Cheetahs.”

Mordt says that the Sharks have several natural runners in the team, but they are not being brought into the game enough.

“Ryan Kankowski is often criticised for not being physical enough, but that is not his game. He is a class player who can hurt teams if he is running on to off-loads and into open spaces. But he can’t do that when there is no one looking to pass to him in the tackle,” he added with exasperation.

Muller suggested that there was still an element of fear in South African rugby, which meant that players rather did the basics instead of looking to create opportunities.

“I think that our players are sometimes too s**t-scared of making a mistake, so they don’t try anything to keep the ball alive.”

Of course, the battering ram mentality spills over into the national team, which has also not set the world alight with their playing style in recent years.

“People say we are winning games, so it’s fine. We may get away with it because of our sheer physicality, but when the scales are even, we don’t have the game-breakers to get us over the line,” Mordt warned.

“You know, ex-players don’t criticise for the hell of it. We are just as passionate about improving our rugby, and we are tired of hearing that we have so much talent in this country, but we don’t see it used properly.

“With the athletes that we have, guys like Marcel Coetzee and Willem Alberts for example, we should be setting the standard in the world game. Alberts could be like Kieran Read in terms of impact, if he was encouraged to bring others into the game more.”

He says the same applies to Coetzee and Stormers’ man-mountain Eben Etzebeth, who both have a massive physical presence, but lack the subtle skills that their Antipodean counterparts display every week.

“I worry about Coetzee, be-cause as good a player as he is, he can’t keep taking those big hits every year. Why has another dimension not been added to his game? Rugby is a physical sport, but only when necessary. You have to be smart… keep the opponent guessing.

“At the moment, the opposition know that Coetzee will never pass, so they target him with three or four guys to either steal the ball, or at least slow it down. You look at a guy like Lappies Labuschagne at the Cheetahs, and he is the standout flanker in our rugby at the moment, because of what he creates for his team,” Mordt pointed out.

“Our approach needs to change, and I think that is all down to one thing,” he added. “Coaching.” - Sunday Tribune


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3596
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 02:56:19

 He also talks about the overweight Steyn.

I am just watching the Sharks Game(vs Rebels) now- 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z78ZNMVRRU4

and the commentator said that he spoke to John Plumtree who said that Frans Steyn

is mostly going to be considered at fullback from now on. (For Rebels game and thereafter)


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3596
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 03:05:38

What makes me wonder is why Keegan Daniel does not play inside center.

He can offload and run onto flat passes better than any of our inside centers.

He has got an excellant step, sublime skills and surely with the experience could be exceptional. Strong Tackler and not really any noticeable weakness of why he would not be a good center.

Even Kankowski has many of the attributes to be a center- he is faster than most backs and has the distribution and runnning skills

When I was in school everyone wanted to play as a loosefoward, and maybe this is why we have so much depth at looseforward in South Africa- as everyone at school boy level wants to be a flank.

 


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3596
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 03:12:22

 

wee Keegan Daniel@ 96kg
Rugby Player
Keegan Rhys Daniel is a South African rugby union player. Born in the rural farming town of Humansdorp, Daniel started his education at Gonubie Primary before moving off to one of South Africa’s best ... Wikipedia
BornMarch 5, 1985 (age 28), Humansdorp, Eastern Cape
Height1.88 m
Weight96 kg

 


sebastienchabal

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Posts: 823
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 03:31:48

Mordt and Muller have it right. Although there is obvious merit in [removed]ysing individual performances the wider picture of the game is often neglected.

There is no doubt that they have highlighted the real problem...it's the style of rugby we play...too s..t scared of making a mistake as Peter correctly says.

Our talent is stifled and inhibited due to game plans implemented by Saffa coaches bar Drostke...thats where teams like Crusaders and Chiefs have the edge in winning grand slams.


polyboy

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 03:37:46

All hail Ray Mordt for saying what needs to be said. Now is anything going to be done about it.  He highlights something that has been known by other teams esp. the AB's for years skillful play trumps "bash em up" play. Now maybe Beeno will take note skillfull "wee" Blacks = winning rugby team.


mozart

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 04:11:44

 

 Kankowski is player who has never found his groove. A few years back Ryan got the ball in space and ran right round Jaque Fourie....he looked awesome. But mostly we see him trying to play a physical game with limited success. He should be our cover defender reaping havoc on opposing backs ....our pace in the pack, cutting onto balls at speed. If you have a power fetcher like Louw you can have a player like Kankan adding the twist to our back play. So far in his career he has been almost totally wasted.


clevermike

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 06:11:37

I wonder what [removed] is going to say about this discussion - since it comes to the point as to the utilization of some players and in particular.  Francois Steyn.    I said elsewhere that Steyn really is a problem - since he crashball circa 50% of the balls passed to him and his passing game really deteriorated to being slow and poor.    Two typical examples of non-existent or poor passing was after Steyn came on from the bench on Saturday.  Steyn got the ball twice in open play and crashalled the ball in the one case (losing possession as well) and in the other case gave a very poor forward pass - I say very poor because it was so fr forward hat the recipient coud not even get to it.  Steyn's game performances are statistically proven and is one of the important aspects that needs to be borne in mind inofar future utilization of him  is concerned,.   And Plumtree saying that he is basically in future going to utlize Steyn at full back is going to give him a seizure.    

The other problem at this stage really is Lambie - he must forget about Meyer's instructions to him to kick the ball away and start playing his natural game.   He went seriously wrong this year in Super 15 and was part of the problem of not properly utilizing the backline.    I did notice that he started to kick less in the last two games - even against the  Brumbies he attacked the gain line a  number of times - but there was no one to pass and off-load the ball to.  On Saturday something was amiss with Lambie - was he carrying an injury because he was not being tilized to kick at goal and was ultimnately subbed becasue of what was claimed to be an injury.  Anyone knows about that issue?

Mozart is in one respect correct - they have managed to make Coetzee a thoughtless duplicate of Alberts - with a difference that Alberts is physically capable of carrying the balls forward in heavy traffic and Coetzee is not.   Last year Coetzee was a completely different player to what he is this year.   What changed within the space of one year?

Another seizure case for [removed] is the take on Labuschagne.   In the games in Super 15 this year he was a mixture of all elements of Loosie play - he can successfully carry balls in traffic - he can fetch balls in the form of turnovers and he can run and pass the ball very well.   Above all he is the SA player with the highest tackle stats in Super 15 this year - matter of fact he constantly tackle players back as well.

That brings me to the issue of coaches and the impact they have on players.   Meyer is a coach that is not interested in the modern game of rugby.    Let me be more specific and give an example using Lambie again.    Meyer made a statement that he was not satisfied with Lambie's kicking game - that being the reason why he never utilized him at flyhalf  in the English and Championship games - keeping him on the bench all the time.    After a very good performance in CC playing a very good all-round game - Meyer changed his tune and selected him for the ROYT.    Without specifying it publically he apparently gave Lambie specific instructions how to play in the first two EOYT - but agsint the English gave him permission to play his natural game - thus letting the cat out of the bag inofar as to his earlier instructions to Lambie.   Is Lambie frightened  out of his wits if he does play his natural game leading to the same scenario as what happened last year and is that the reason why he never really got going this year?  Is the reason for the change in Coetzee's game since last year also the result of the Meyer factor as to how players should play the game?   I believe that it has a major impact on the way players play - otherwise they could really nullify their chances of being selected for the Springboks.

Coetzee of the Stormers did the same thing last year - play a defensive game without enterprise at all.  I did notice some change in approach this year and in the last two ganes the Stormers scored 7 tries  and for the first time since 2011 got a try bonus  point.   The backline was not as effective as it should be and there were mistakes made and in fact penalties given away and passes going astray - but they did play  a more attcaking backline play than was the case last year.    However, the comments are correct - the only team with rather average backline players that would not be in consideration for the Speingboks - that showed any real all-round performances was the Cheetahs.  

I think the problem as to playing strategies starts at the top with Meyer and his approach to the game.   The players themselves are infkuenced by it because they fear that they can jeopardize their potential Springbok selection and even if the coaches wants them to play differently they would not oblige them and would continue to play the Meyer game so as to enhance their selectability for the Springbok team.

 


Saffex

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 11:46:20

Well to prove that Mordt has it wrong and Muller has it right, the Sharks played without Frans at 12 against the Rebels and the backline was no better than it has been all season. Hell and to think they were playing the worst side in the competition


clevermike

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 12:03:39

[removed]`

So Mordt is suddenly wrong and so is Plumtree when he said he is primarily going to use Steyn at full back.   That means that Steyn is third on the list of 12's - with Whitehead at 1 and Bosman at 2.    He is third on the list of full backs after Lu[removed] and Viljoen and the best he can hope for is bench selection in future.

Your idea of good backline play is warped and I think on Saturday for some reason or another Lambie actually had a very poor game comparative to his normal performances.   He was not the Lambie we used to see.    He did pass balls to Bosman - and despite your take Bosman did play a role in getting the backline moving.   Man for man they were all better than they were in the first four games of the season.   The change from Bosman to Steyn did produce some goods and the situation will keep on improving.   At least the ead backline syndrome that bedevilled the Sharks first four games this year was not in evidence this time around.

Come now- be honest.   It does look like Steyn's days as center for the Sharks and consequently for the Springboks are numbered and he is unlikely to feature much in future.   He should concentrate at playing at full back - so lets hope he can settle in in that position better than he did in the number 12 jersey.

 


Saffex

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 13:31:17

Stop lying DomMike, Plum has not said anything about where Frans will be playing. The only thing he said in that interview when asked if Frans might move to 15, was that he might if Ludik was injured.

 

Meyer is a huge fan of Frans at 12, once he is fit Frans will be back at 12 for the Sharks and the Boks later in the year.

 

One certainty is that Muller is right, he said it was wrong to blame Frans and this was vindicated by the poor backline performance against the Rebels - FACT

 

Man for man the Sharks backs were not better than the Rebels, in particular the centres - that is just complete bull[removed]. Reinach, Lambie, Mvovo and Ludik might have been better.......JP, Bosman and Jordaan were not


sebastienchabal

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 14:23:38

Most of you are missing the point what Ray and Peter are saying...they're talking about the game plan and the style of rugby Saffa coaches are implementing...not about criticising individual players...the cart before the horse.

You can have a team full of prima donnas which will lose to side with good players who are structured and coached right with an effective game plan. If they continue to persist stubbornly with this conservative and uncreative style then nothing will change much...you can rant and rave as much as you like about individual players but nothing will change until this issue is addressed correctly.


clevermike

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 14:55:00

Seb

You are absolutely correct about the game plan and Meyer lays down the rules and everyone seems to be accepting that.

However , any game plan has to ingredients, namely -

*    the game plan itself; and

*   the  abilties of the players themselves to implement the plan.

Meyer is absolutely addicted to kicking as an integral part of his plan - hence his insistence that Lambie had to up his kicking game before h could play at flyhalf - and now suddenly Lambie has become a mirror-image of Morne Steyn.   The second issue is that backline play is not of value - and Meyer has said publicly that SA players are incapbale of playing attacking backline play..    Those two examples should illustrate what Meyer's priorities are.

The players in line for Springbok selection are not going to jeopardise their selection by playing a different style of rugby - even if their own coaches says otherwise.   The franchise coaches will probably not be able to change the scenario at all - even though they may wish to do otherwise.   Because with Goosen out injurd there are virtually no potential Springboks left in the Cheetahs team - they are playing like they do. because they can afford not to adhere to Meyer's game plan. 


Saffex

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 16:03:15

Seb, am not missing the point. Mordt says that Frans is just crashballing - that is bull[removed] and he fails to appreciate the fact that the game has moved on somewhat since his playing days.

 

I do agree that our sides except the Cheetahs are playing a conservative style - hell thats not new - its the SA way. We see glimpses of the Sharks running it at times but lets face it - not often enough.

 

SA should embrace the Cheetahs model, with the added advantage of dominating the physical battles. We do have all this backline talent, but we dont use it and we do have forwards with skill who end up becoming battering rams


Beeno1

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 16:32:44

Poly I have long lamented the lack of rugby a[removed]en of our coaches. So point you finger elsewhere.

As to the abs you can almost halve their winning record if you remove the consequence of their bent refs - ditto super 15 etcYou Are The Man Beeno!

 


Beeno1

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 16:42:55

Add skills and nous to the physicality as snapster says and you have the Boks of old who ruled the abs with a firm hand.

Trouble is we select dumb franchise coaches and let the best go or rot.  There are no brains at the top and issues other than merit rule. We then expect the Bok coach to sort it all out.

However its rubbish to say only the Cheethas play enterprisng rugby. The Lions did, the Sharks did last year and last Saturday and this year the Stormers have scored 7 tries in their last 2 matches and showed some spark. Perhaps a penny is dropping. Even the bulle showed they can run in a few tries.

However there is a lot of work need by coaches with the brain to do it.

 


Saffex

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 26, 2013, 17:19:39

Well Beenkop, Meyer hardly did himself any favours with some suspect selections and a Bulls style game plan. He had plenty to work with but failed to deliver in his first year of office.

 

He needs to improve in a big way........starting by being less conservative with his selections


polyboy

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 00:23:03

Beeno, the Boks of old never ruled the AB's in fact the win/loss margin before isoation was +3 or something like that to the Boks but this was  because of the then apartheid policy not allowing coloured (maori or part Maori) players to tour until the 70's and crooked SA refs who controlled the test series on SA soil, ( the 76 series being a perfect example of a SA ref blatant bias) so quit your bleating about "bent" refs, you guys pioneered that concept, do you think its coincedence that once neutral refs were used the pendulum swung the AB's way. I bet if neuutral refs were used from the beginning in AB/Bok matches the AB winning record would be huge at the moment its damn near embarrasing for the Boks. Now on your knees and kiss that.


Sharkbok

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 03:20:24

@polyboy, I am not sure if not having coloured players can be used to attribute losses because the Springboks did not have colour players either. 

Bryan Habana is possibally the best Springbok of the professional era and he is of colour.

So not allowing players of colour to represent either teams has weakened the resource base of both teams. 

Am i right in saying that more Maori players represent the All Blacks today than say in the 1960's?

This is just speculation on my part as I have seen some old historical matches but I cant be sure of any solid stats.

I do not personally buy into many refeeres being corrupt from any country,

but some individuals are more incompetent than others.

Not sure what it was like in the olden days in the amateur era.

Not taking sides but I have heard this old arguement being thrown around the campfire before and thought I would add my 2cents


mozart

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 04:31:10

Some telling points SB......seen in that light SA was most hurt by its policies. 


sebastienchabal

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Posts: 823
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 07:09:18

Hey guys this has nothing to do with the topic at hand and I suggest you avoid raising a sensitive subject...incidentally NZ had Maoris in the 60's and 70's...cannot remember them all but the names of Sid Going and Bryan (Brian) Williams come to memory.

Again this is about the game plan,the approach and style...nothing to do with the pool of talent to draw from and even in the nasty days there was an abundance of talent but ironically the coaches were good..ie Izak Van Heerden etc.

Just look at http://youtu.be/DuE0e-e1Y3g for backline play...who said Naas couldn't run and attack and the above Ray Mordt knows what this topic is about.


sebastienchabal

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 823
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 07:36:50

and lest we forget...the way of Springbok rugby...

http://youtu.be/42wWNuwQf88

 

 


Beeno1

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 08:50:12

ou Poly has just sunk himself this time by an error in logic. When we played in nz which was half the time - we played Maoris. Neither in nz or in SA did you meet people of colour so who was damaged most? Neither did we import blacks from the rest of Africa like nz did the islanders etc etc

As for bent refs nz is now notorious for the same. No comment really necessary

Bwahahahhahahahaha love it when these nz oaks pin themsleves. Hopeless they are! ROTFL ROTFL  ROTFL

Beeno ring master of the nz oaks.


Beeno1

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 08:54:25

Please snapster get some perspective. Had morne kicked to his normal standards we would have won the Championship and lost only 1 test in the entire year.

This with a new team where many a Bok was missing due to retirement or injury.

Snapster Meyer did extraordinarily well if you take these things into account. Strip out the draws and his win loss record is fine. Wakey, wakey!!!

End of story.


clevermike

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 09:23:02

Beeno

Mordt is right - our backline play is morbid and poor.   How far can we advance in Workd Rugby by not utlizng our backline properly?   Meyer is largely to blame for that deficiency by -

*   constantly harping on the kicking game of inside backs;

*   making statement that we have no backline players capable pof playing attacking/running rugby; and

*   and by his selection of players incapable of even playing the game he requires from them.

I am not impressed by SARU either.  Their lack of appointment of spcialists to enhance backline performances is scandalous in the extreme and is a disgrace for SA Rugby.   It is as if thy believe that rugby is played by 10players with five used fordecoraive purposes only.   As long as that belief is in place our rugby will always be second class.


polyboy

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 13:37:32

Sharkbok I was referring to the fact that you had players like George Nepia and I think Waka Nathan both Maori the best at their time in their positions in NZ  not being able to tour because of their colour. Therefore the best players weren't taken. It wasn't their colour I was alluding to it was the fact that the best team didn't necessarily tour.  Beeno, what has really sunk is your intellect...follow this simple logic, Apartheid was a SA racial restrictive policy carried out in SA....the SA government then mandated no non white players could tour...again in SA. Outside of SA NZ did not have a Apartheid policy so the Boks were able to play Maori teams, no coloured teams played in SA by the AB's was down to your government at that time and I would say the only team who missed out was the Boks cause your team could've been grooming an untouched rugby resource decades ago. Provide substantiated proof that islanders were imported by NZ, this is the height of ignorance on your part, what can't you understand about multi ethnic societies, like I said in past, Islanders are very family orientated, so when they migrate its to places where they have....family...like NZ...where rugby is the national sport...islanders love contact sport....like rugby...therefore they play.....rugby and if good enough play for AB's.  Wanna know how I know this ....my family is from the islands..if you haven't lived it then you don't know.  Hope you enjoyed being schooled...love how you fobbed off the ref issue.


carpetmuncher

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 13:45:27

from one of SA's best wingers. ray knows his rugby and his passion for dynamic attack based rugby has always been his strong suite

 

i agree with mike as mike has always has the right mindset

i have posted about this to no end. SA obsession with size and weight has overshadowed skills/attackin ablitys since at least 1992. that has always been our biggest problem our obsession with tryiing to dominate the gainline instead of playing a balanced game that develops players and fine tunes there instincts and thinking.

 

post 1992 int he older days this was never really a issue as coaches tended to coach more generally. now the obsession with size and phased structured play has basically destroyed our development of young free thinking skillfull players. even our juniors that show a lot of promise is donkey coached to not think fro themselves but rather be overcoached in terms how and where on the field they should attack

 

meyer and coetzee/brendon venter are the past masters of the overcoaching brand. meyer is well known for giving players even handbooks how how and where on the field they should stand and how many players should leave a ruck ext on attack. instead of teaching players to indentify how to do what by themselves and in the process become free thinking they go the opposite route.

 

in terms of our backline play first of attacking play is not only the backline's domain but the forwards are the ones that should create the type of ball that allows the backs to run into space and create chances to score from not pigeon hole players that are being brainwashed into setting up phase play just for another forward to bash his way into a player instead of running into space.

 

at the end of the day every countrys overall game pattern dictates how the players are developed and how that ripples through the system and SARU and co cannot see that there is a massive massive problem with how all our unions and national teams are playing right now then the boks are slowly but surely being bled dry.

 

as mike said it seems 10 blokes are allowed to touch the ball the rest are tackle bags standing in the line. players like franna steyn is the product of the meyer "bash it up and dont even dare or even think of creating space game plan"

 

i would like anyone to just attend a practice session of any sa team and just after that compare it how the aussies or even how the ab sides prepare for there games...the differences are massive. the bullcrap statements like meyer made that we dont have the backs to play more modern rugby is utter and complete hogwash.

 

we need the likes of board of a center of performance that monitors how the local sides play there rugby and a overrall template should be used. that is the job of rassie erasmus but if one looks at how things are right now one can see that he is not doing his job.

 

a backline advisor to all the sides should be employed to help develop our skillsets and hone there attacking skills and for that i cant think of anyone better than carlos spencer.

 

UNTIL THAT ASPECT OF OUR RUGBY IS FIXED WE CAN FORGET OF BEING THE NUMBER ONE SIDE IN THE WORLD

 

SIZE OF RUGBY PLAYERS IS IMPORTANT BUT IT WONT EVER EVER MAKE UP FOR TALENT AND SKILLS.


clevermike

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RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 14:07:21

Carpetmuncher

You are 100% correct and I wish Saru would realise it and d something about it.   However. I do not think the dumbos will do anything and wwill argue like hell that they do.   Bad buggers at SARU


Beeno1

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Posts: 11681
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 14:08:47

Ou maaaik please prettyy please wake up. I have long suggested getting backline coaches from outside if necessary. I have noted how the bulle performed better when Todd Louden was coaching their backline and ditto Campo with the sharks etc.

Mordt squealing now is many years behind yours truly and one wonders why he is coming out now. Our major problem has been poor selction of coaches. Explain why coaches like Jake, Mallet, Venter and Rassie are not Super 15 coaches? Why Mitchell got the boot because of lazy players not wanting a bit of necessary discipline. why we dont use outsiders more when quite obviously we could do with some input.

However onemistake we must avoid is adopting nz basket ball rugby. We need to play as again I note (Wake up ou Maaaik) like snapster says with our traditio[removed] physicality but with more skills and go back to a more balanced game.

As for the hatter Poly he has no clue whatsoever - the whole point I was making is we were the more disavataged player wise as I explained  - the plonk then says " I would say the only team who missed out was the Boks cause your team could've been grooming an untouched rugby resource decades ago". Exactly my point - ROTFLROTFL  ROTFL

Your use of islanders for abs and Super 15 i swell know. No cover ups please. However it looks like Oz with more money is going to do the same so hard times ahead for wee abs.

Polys schooling continues.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12539
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 14:36:56

Beeno

I do not think you reallu started the serious criticisms as to backline play - the real moise in thepast was raised by Carpet and myself.   I amust admit you did support our concepts and suggestions.

Look physicality is one thing - the other component is ball sense and skills.   The generaally smaller players of the Stormers - with the exception of De Jongh who showd nothing and missed the crucial tackle on Speight that led to the Brumbies try - played well on Saturday against the Brumbies.   Smaller players like Aplon can perform against bigger ones - provided they have ball sense and skills to help overcome their deficiency in size.  

It is obviously advantageous to have bigger players in thebacklinewit the necessary speed and skill sets - but those are not always available.   Most of our backline players has about as much ball sense as Tweety Bird - they are clueless at best.    The other issue is that they are very poor ball handlers as well and make more mistakes than they should.

I do not really favour the ideas of the New Zealand teams to pass the ball around all the time - it looks attractive - but there arefar too many handling errors blunting the effectiveness of the teams.   However, there can be no argument that their players are more skilled in ball handling and their backlines are better in playing attacking rugby.    We should take some lessons from them - but not necessarily copy their style of play.

 


sebastienchabal

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 823
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 16:08:03

Smaller players like Aplon can perform against bigger ones - provided they have ball sense and skills to help overcome their deficiency in size.  

Depends to what degree, Crafty Mike...changed my avatar to make a point...LOL


carpetmuncher

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1396
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 16:38:42

@beeno using mitchell as a example is not a great one....its well do[removed]ented that he is a ego maniac and was a abusive coach. a coach like [removed]ton from the kings would win the super 15 within 2 seasons with a team like the stormers. just because the mental space that NZ coaches has and the approach is light years ahead than any other local coach. naka in my view is the one that comes the closest.

 

the only reason the cheetahs can punch above there weight in terms of competiveness is due to there development systems and there game pattern. game pattern dictates everything.....everthing. how players are selected how you train who you pick ext ext. the list goes on and on.

 

jake was in the same mindset but since eddie jones expanded his skillset one can see that the teams that jake coaches plays more structured but has that element of freedom and purpose on attack.....that we need badly in SA. its vital for the health and future growth of SA rugby that we adopt free thinking open game plan. the way the IRB has changed the rules and will in the future is promoting that style of play so if we dont fall in line and change our ways we will be left behind.

 

from a coaching perspective i see rubbish backline errors poor off the ball options. rubbish support play. backline players with weak/slow hand speed and slow width and speed of pass. varsity cup backline on a techincal level are more advance than some of our super 15 sides ? how is it basket ball rugby beeno if players like jean cant pass to his left as good as to his right ?. jean more than often get caught with the ball in play flows towards his weaker passing hand.

 

NZ backline play is not basket ball rugby is calculated and measured. one must earn the right to go wide that is the golden rule


moolaa

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 666
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 22:53:05

Beeno still going on about Steyn's missed kicks and ignoring draws to make the Bok's win record look better in 2012!

Living in the past Beeno. You really are a sad arse and frankly a total embarrassment to your country and especially your fellow Saffas on this site who must cringe evey time you post your drivel!


polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 506
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 23:41:09

Beeno you need to be playing outside Goosen because you have the best sidestep on this forum.  You sidestep issues like  crooked NZ refs, as if the AB's did not have the same problem in SA, the polynesian issue obviously cause you have no  idea what your talking about, that's the problem with picking up on unsubstantiated internet rumours, its had to argue facts when all you have is fiction.   You had no idea how apartheid in the day affected foreign team selection of players to tour SA in that players of colour that were the best in their position couldn't tour and instead  go off on some illogical rant about playing Maori teams in NZ.  As to my statement regarding "which team was disadvantaged" you asked a question which obviously you had no idea  what the anwser was so I anwsered it for you, if anything you should show a modi[removed] of gratitude for me clearing that up for you. honestly, isn't that how that works if you're asked a question.  So Beeno to be schooled you have to be taught something which as you can see I've taught you enough here to get a degree in humble pie, now knuckle down and you might just pass Rugby 101.  Looking forward to more laughy icons.

 


polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 506
RE: Ray Mordt questions Direct Game Plan & Coaches Approach
March 27, 2013, 23:44:53

Clevermike

Your right don't copy the AB's style, adapt your own skill set to the game plan, encourage individualism from players like Serfontein, Goosen, lambie and co, improve the skills of the forward and their ability to link with the backs and BAM maybe the AB's might have something to worry about.


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