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3435 Topic: Carlos a Shark
Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 10:51:53

Rugby 365:

The Sharks have recruited former All Blacks flyhalf and Lions assistant coach Carlos Spencer as they prepare for the upcoming Super Rugby season. The former Blues playmaker served as John Mitchell's assistant at the Lions where he had a big impact on the development of Springbok flyhalf Elton Jantjies, and after parting ways with the Johannesburg franchise he has linked up with the Sharks. A mercurial pivot, Spencer played 93 times for Auckland during a purple period in the team's history, also playing 35 times for New Zealand before embarking on a career in the Northern Hemisphere, making over 100 appearances for Northampton Saints. "His experience as a player and the opportunity for us to use him - no one was - was great for us," said Sharks coach John Plumtree. "He loves his coaching and his knowledge of flyhalf and backline play is invaluable, he will also be looking at kicking skills, he was a great tactical kicker himself and he is really good at passing on his knowledge. "We're thrilled to have the opportunity to use him here and it's good for the players to have a change. Because he's going to be here for a couple of weeks, he can enjoy himself and get to know the players which can only be of benefit for everyone. "I was really impressed with what he did with Elton Jantjies," added Plumtree. Spencer said he was thrilled to be in Durban with the Sharks and looked forward to working with the team. "I'm really looking forward to it; Plum [Plumtree] invited me to come here and spend a couple of weeks with the Sharks, obviously to have a look at Pat Lambie and a few of the other boys. I'm really happy to be here. "The Sharks have always been a very competitive side, they've always been up there amongst the top teams, be it Currie Cup or Super Rugby. They've always had a very dominant forward pack and backed that up with some pretty skilful backs. They are always challenging for a top four spot and finals, they're an exciting team to watch. "They play a good brand of rugby, one I enjoy as well, being an attacking player. "They came close last year and hopefully they can do it this year, I'm looking forward to it, to see how they go this year." Working primarily with the flyhalves, he will spend a lot of time with Lambie during his stay in Durban. "I enjoyed my time with Elton, he’s an exciting and skilful player, Pat is built along the same lines. He's one of those up and coming players with a lot of skill and one certainly for the future - both for the Sharks and South African rugby. I'm looking forward to spending a bit of time with him and hopefully I can share a few of my ideas with him and teach him a bit of stuff," he added.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12890
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 11:01:31

Ek

This is really excellent news.   Why is it that the Sharks take the lead with the appointment of Spencer and the Boks sits around with a nonentity?  I nearly said "sh!ts" - the situation is so bad.


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 11:17:50

Well Firstly Mike you can't just fire a guiy if you appointed him on contract and then appoint someone else in his place.

Secondly The boks have a backline coach irrelevant of who it is.

They can still get carlos in as a consultant If they want, with the emphasis on want. i don't know the dynamics, And I don't know carlos as a person.

But when i appoint someone I make sure that they will fit into the team, so sometimes I will appoint someone who is technically below someone else, however, they will fit into the team so they team as a unit will funtion better.

So guys constantly making the statement of appoint the best and that guys is better appoint him are always making that statement without knowling the dynamic of the team and the guy's personality.

So to give you an answer after my novel that I wrote:

Firstly, I don't know how Carlos got to the Sharks, but he was out of a job, He might have been headhunted in that case wonderfull job Sharks, or he might have applied for a position, in that case wonderfull appointement Sharks....That is from a technical standpoint, However that is all we know, so maybe he works out maybe he doesn't. I have no idea on how good he is at transferring the excellent nowledge that he has, Apparently not so good as you don't think he made a success out of Jantjies.

I don't know why the boks are sittiing around witha non entity, I don't know the dynamics of the structure as I don't know the people involved.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12890
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 11:30:36

Ek

Agree with you on the contracting issue - but maybe the whole process started by Meyer was askew.

His first priority was to appoint vwirtually the whole Bulls coaching set-up on the basis that he was acquainted wit them - in other words not because of their competency.  Louscher was the Vodacom Cup backline coach - and is now the national assistant backline coach - three steps up from the level where he used to coach.   Our backline performances are not up to standard - matter of fact atrocious if real performances are borne in mind.

I also feel that if for incompetence reasons they cannot get rid of Loubscher - they should get in technical advisors to enhance skills development and technical strategy development in respect of backline processes and play. 

 

 


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11951
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 11:40:12

Ehem Mike - Plumtree said  "I was really impressed with what he did with Elton Jantjies,"  So that makes Mitchell, Meyer, Coetzee and Plumtree thinking Jantjes must be at least reasonable at flyhalf.

Of course its great news for the sharks and I wish him every success. Maybe the penny will finally drop that we need a guy like this in every SA franchise and of course especially for the Boks.

Go Carlos! Show them what a real backline coach can do! This could be a turning point in SA rugby where we rediscover our backline potential! I hope it is a big eye opener. The Lions backs were dangerous when Carlos was coaching. The sharks have an international class backline so Carlos has lots to work with.

Ek were the Bok assistant coaches appointed for one year or longer?


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 11:47:25

No idea on the terms of their contracts Beeno. I supposed It would be close to the terms of the head coach.


polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 507
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 13:33:31

Couldn't be happier for the Boks, In his day Carlos was legendary, so damn unpredictable but if he can bring the best out of the backs so be it. Suppose it takes a kiwi to beat the AB's.


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 13:55:53
polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 112
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 13:33:31

Couldn't be happier for the Boks, In his day Carlos was legendary, so damn unpredictable but if he can bring the best out of the backs so be it. Suppose it takes a kiwi to beat the AB's.

Clearly you have misread the information above.

Or I am misunderstanding you totally...


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 13:55:54
polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 112
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 13:33:31

Couldn't be happier for the Boks, In his day Carlos was legendary, so damn unpredictable but if he can bring the best out of the backs so be it. Suppose it takes a kiwi to beat the AB's.

Clearly you have misread the information above.

Or I am misunderstanding you totally...


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3684
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 14:38:59

 Good news, Carlos was the best attacking flyhalf I have ever seen. He could easily have played at inside center as well, which he did for the All Blacks outside Andrew Mertens.

 His passing skills were sublime, tactical kicking and ability to create space outside him. Perhaps the boks can sign him up to get involved in the juniors as a skills specialist coach for the backline


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 14:46:53

What i find odd thoug is the fact that the Lions let him go, If he is soooo good why would they let him go?

Just a thought, he was a brilliant Player, but .............

Let us hope for the sharks that he can actually impart his knowledge, or maybe that wasn't the issue with the Lions, maybe there were some personality clashes......

We will never know.


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3684
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 15:01:42

 ek the Lions are incompetent, and Spencer was just the most recent in a series of scapegoats. Carlos is still new to coaching but surely his knowledge of the game is better than the next clown the lions sign.


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 15:04:58

Honestly Sharkbok, that is still to be defined, As I said we won't know what went on in the Lion Circustent.

So let's hope for Carlos' sake that he is succesfull then as he is the only one that could prove the point.


mozart

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 8710
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 16:06:06

I wonder what this travelling cadre of NZ mercenary coaches really think about SA rugby players. My guess is they don't have much respect for our chaps and that was one of the factors that ultimately sunk Mitchell at the Lions. Carlos as a player was a pretty arrogant bugger, so I doubt he is all warm and fuzzy.

 

Lambie already has a better sense of tactics than Carlos ever had in his playing days. That's why the much less physically talented Mehrtens, more of a Lambie type, mostly kept Carlos on the bench.

 


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12890
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 16:32:53

Mozart

Irrespective of what you may say - Spencer is a hell of a lot better than the non-exitent backline coaching in evidence amongst the Springboks at present.

Mitchell wanted performance from his players at the Lions and they under-performed on Super 15 level after winning the CC whilst coached by Mitchell.   He started to take action - for instance against Jantjies in one game against the Stormers - where he buggered up completely and the next moment a petition organized by two players started.   Virutally all the players signed the petition - but when a hearing on the issue was finally held only the two petition organisers (Strauss and Jantjies) turned up.   The hearing could find no concrete evidence to support the contention of the two organisers and Mitchell had to be re-instated.

 


allblacknblue

Status: Baby Bok
Posts: 233
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 18, 2013, 21:17:32

Spencer is a bit like Cruden and Lambie is a bit like Carter only not as good.

If all goes well I think Spencer could be quite the revelation for young Lambie, Spencers experience and fliar will certainly lend itself to the weaker side of Lambie's game for sure.


polyboy

Status: Squad member
Posts: 507
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 19, 2013, 01:31:58

Ek No, your right misread it. Carlos to Sharks NOT Boks, though Boks would probably be better off with him than what his name? And ABB Cruden is a poor man's Spencer, but he is afterall still a work in progress and may get close to Spencer in his prime.


Brycy

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1319
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 19, 2013, 05:35:48

Bean Brain are you feeling okay??

 You hope Carlos Spencer's appointment will be the turning point in bok rugby??

Freakin hilarious how you're heralding Carlos as the saviour of your once Mighty Boks. He's a New Zealander is'nt he??

I can see the headlines now: NewZealander saves South African rugby from fading into oblivion...

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

How did the Lions go last year with him again ??

... then again ,you're the only one who thinks John Mitchell is a good coach so it's hard to take anything you say seriously...but try not to rely on the kiwis so much Bean Brain.

Learn to stand on yr own two feet for a change...


Sharkbok

Status: Senior player
Posts: 3684
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 19, 2013, 16:43:21

 Brycy just to let you know the plan for 2013 and beyond. Once Carlos Spencer sorts out the backline, we plan to replace our forwards with the Springbok womens forwards to give you a chance! LMAO!!!!


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11951
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 19, 2013, 18:28:44

 Welcome back to the board brcy tyou hatter. I waitedin vain for a comment re the cricket but of course I do understand! Bwahahahahahahahahha

Brycy please get some perpective here. What I am so obviously saying is that a good backline coach will do a lot of good for the sharks. It just happens this backline coach is a a kiwi. It could have been any top backline coach from any nation. The point brycy is that if a good backline coach shows what can be done then maybe it will get other coaches here realising our backlines do not play to potential and thus something would then be done to rectify matters. 

Sharkbok I dont think the wee kiwis are going to know what has hit them over the next few years. 

That John Mitchell is a decent coach was shown when he was offered a post in the NH. That he is highly regarded by the lions is indicated by them wanting him as a consultant.

Brycy please try and keep your biased views under some sort of control. You clearly dont like his coaching non nz sides and are somewhat petulant about it. Hahahahahaha.

 


Brycy

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1319
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 19, 2013, 20:37:39

Bean Brain you 're more delusional than i thought if you think last years wooden spooners have the coaching staff to save SA rugby .And to think yr actually serious about a twat like mitchel is so funny we may have to event a new emoticon especially - does one with a head coming off from laughing too hard exist? .

BTW we need to thank you big time for killing off cricket in this country..the best thing that ever happened to that sport in NZ. Was a bit worried for a while after you lost the first two games of the tour.

So big thankyou to you and crazy eyes ( who's that again dunno but sounds like you might be related??) Keep up the good work .

Two yarpies in our team now also i think so the game was doomed anyway with imposters infiltrating our national team  - should'nt be tolerated but seeing we'tre trying to kill off cricket in this country i'll make an exception this time LMAO

 Looking forward to some real summer sport though in march when we host the World Champs....a game we have won consecutively since 1984 except the Aussies jammed the last one - bloody aussies always stealing our stuff but this year we will be taking back the title. Is SA sending a team??? Don't think they even have one LMAO - probably just as well cause you'd only be getting jacked out of the ball park....


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 11951
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 21, 2013, 09:10:20

As I noted elsehere brycy the back caps havent collpased in a heap like you - they are showing some backbone.

brycy league means zip here. I have never watcheda league gme and doubt I ever will. They tried to get it going here and we had a team called the Rhinos - havent heard anything about league here for years. Its not a popular sport I believe with oz, nz and UK playing it but who else?

Rugby Union on the other hand has a world wide following. The league twits should just pack up shop and play union - if they are up to it.


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12890
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 21, 2013, 11:49:10

Beeno

I do not envy Spencer his task in this case.   He would have no problems with Lambie, Jordaan, Pietersen and Lu[removed].   Those four are all playes with the right instincts and would improve easily in refining of plays.

The main problem will be with Francois Steyn.   If he can succeed in getting a sense of center play into that one - he would have achieved a miracle.   I assume that he would have to teach him from basic school stuff, namely -

*   how to run towards gaps and not straight at the opposing defenders;

*   how to pass balls;

*   how to off-load balls in tackle situations;

*   how to use grubber and chip kicks to best advanatge; and

*   how to read games better and see how situations could be optimized.

Just a few things that Steyn has not shown after his return from France.   Hope he is successful in turning around this player.   He should spend times also to make sure that Steyn loses some lard and raises his speed in the process.

I give Spencer nothing more than a 30% chance to succeed - but lets hold thumbs and see what happens

 


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 21, 2013, 11:54:53

Mike, if you remember correctly, When Frans started out that is what he did well, that was his natural Game....

Maybe Carlos is the right guy for him...


clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 12890
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 21, 2013, 12:11:00

Ek

100% true - I thought he was the real deal when he first came n the scene.   But he has lost it and maybe I am too harsh about the issue - maybe Steyn has a chance to get back to play top class rugby again.


Brycy

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1319
RE: Carlos a Shark
January 22, 2013, 05:22:17

Bean Brain, where in my post did i mention rugby league??? Sometimes i wonder about you mate LMAO. But seeing you mentioned it.,  the Rugby League World Cup kicks off in October hosted by England and Wales but doesn't look like SA was invited LMAO. You need to be tough mate to play league but not sure if thats why you were left out...

Was reffering before to the 2013 World Softball Championship in March above but does'nt look like you were invited to that either LMAO. It's where we kick the Canadians and Americans butts - lil ol New Zealand the giant killers.

...so you can keep yr cricket Bean Brain - too fken boring..was funny though how in their last game yr cricket team was fined for cheating and the captain suspended - try and win the one day series and restore some pride for gods sake...don't want the crowd to start booing do we?

Medal table

Rank  Nation Gold Silver Bronze Total
1  New Zealand 5 3 2 10
2  United States 5 1 3 9
3  Canada 3 5 2 10
4  Australia 1 0 1 2
5  Mexico 0 1 1 2
6  Japan 0 1 1 2
7  Bahamas 0 0 1 1


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