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2860 Topic: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
Beeno1

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Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 14:25:29

Ex Keo

Allister Coetzee says he’s excited to have on-loan Springbok and Lions duo Elton Jantjies and Jaco Taute in his Stormers squad next year.

Taute confirmed his move to keo.co.za last Wednesday, while WPRU president Thelo Wakefield also told this site that he approved Jantjies’ deal late last week.

Coetzee believes the two players will make telling contributions next season.

‘We’re very excited about having Elton and Jaco in Cape Town for next year’s Super Rugby tournament,’ said Coetzee. ‘They’re both quality players and we look forward to getting them involved here – both on and off the field – and seeing how they fit into the Stormers culture.’

Jantjies is expected to get a run in the starting line-up during the opening rounds of Super Rugby, considering the departure of WP’s Currie Cup-winning flyhalf Demetri Catrakilis to the Southern Kings and the late arrival of Peter Grant from Japan in February.

While Taute is able to play at centre and fullback, he’s likely to compete for the No 15 jersey as the Stormers already have Jean de Villiers, Juan de Jongh, Marcel Brache and JP du Plessis in their midfield department. Damian de Allende is also considered to be in the mix after his impressive performance at inside centre in the Currie Cup final. (Pat Howard can play center as well)

Taute has the option of extending his stay in Cape Town after the Super Rugby season as his contract with the Lions expires next year. (Hope he stays!!!)

The Stormers have also signed utility forward Michael Rhodes (who can play lock or flank) and Springbok versatile prop Pat Cilliers from the Lions on permanent deals

Well it seems Mike and Alistair Coetzee have a difference in opinion re Jantjes.


clevermike

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 14:31:51

Beeno

We will see early in the season whether Coetzee is right or whether I am right.   Coetzee is like a puppy - his eyes will only open - say 8 days after the second Super 15 game of the Stormers next year.  Let him enjoy hie eupheria in the meantime - a rude awakening is certain to follow.   Did WP not have a sigh of relief when Earl Rose was leaving?   That would be nothing compared to Jantjies going.  


mozart

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 17:43:23

Jantjies will be fine in the lesser S15 games, but fold when the pressure is on....but by then Grant should be available. Glad to see Taute is destined for fullback


Saffex

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 19:08:03

Jantjies will thrive in the company of the Stormers and Taute should easily be able to replace the ineffective de Jongh at 13 for the Stormers - the player who scored how many tries all S15?


WPXV

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 19:42:57

Better squad than this in the Super 15 next year?

15: Jaco Taute (21), Joe Pietersen (28)

14: Bryan Habana (29), Gerhard Van den Heever (23)

13: Juan De Jongh (24), JP Du Plessis (21)

12: Jean De Villiers (31), Damian de Allende (21), Marcel Brache (25)

11: Gio Aplon (30), Patrick Howard (20)

10: Elton Jantjies (22), Peter Grant (28), Tim Swiel (19)

9: Nic Groom (22), Louis Schreuder (22), Dewald Duvenaghe (24)

 

8: Duane Vermeulen (26), Nizaam Carr (21)

7: Schalk Burger (29), Rynhard Elstadt (23), Michael Rhodes (25), Don Armand (24)

6: Siya Kolisi (21), Fourie* , Josh Katzen (20)

5: Andries Bekker (29), De Kock Steenkamp (25), Ruan Botha (20)

4: Eben Etzebeth, Rhodes*, Armand*, Elstadt*

3: Patric Cilliers (25), Frans Malherbe (21), Brok Harris (27)

2: Deon Fourie (26), Tiaan Liebenberg (31), Scarra Ntubeni (21)

1: Steven Kitshoff (20), Deon Carstens (33)

 

 

* Can cover those poistions


mozart

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 20:09:57

You are suggesting replacing the player (de Jongh) who won the CC, with the player (Taute) who lost the NZ test? Sure Dave ....good one!


clevermike

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 20:22:46

Mozart

Three tries in a year and giiving away a dosen penalties and a dozen handovers  should be issues to be borne in mind.   De Jongh is a lost cause and I would repalce him with Howard or Du Plessis - Taute my mind should be played at full back.   That flash in the pan try does not qualify an otherwise useless player to be kepy in a yeam.   What about the two converted penalties he gave away on Saturday????


sasuke uchiha

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Posts: 5864
RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 21:18:06

@mozart,

de jong playing well in the CC and taute playing porrly, i mean horribly against the ABs are two different things, on that day against the All Blacks, the chances of de jong having a bad game would have been just as high as the chances of taute playing well against the sharks in the finals.


sasuke uchiha

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 5864
RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 21:33:49

janties and taute will both thrive in the stormers enviroment, but im not too sure taute is going to replace de jong, i can only see it happening in a rotation or injury capacity.

i really think this stormers team has the goods to go all the way next year with janties and taute on board, for me the best thing about this team is the depth they have to cover all bases and hopefully in 2013, lady injury is a lot kinder to them then it was this year.

my stormers No1 team atm would have to be,,,
1 s kitshoff, 2 t liebenburg, 3 f malharbe, 4 e ezbeth, 5 a bekker, 6 s kolisi, 7 s burger, 8 d vermeulen, 9 d duvenage, 10 e janties, 11 g aplon, 12 JDV, 13 j de jong, 14 b habana, 15 j taute
16 s ntubeni, 17 p cilliers, 18  r botha, 19 r elsdtat, 20 n grrom, 21 p grant, 22 j pieterson

the number of class players not named in the 22 should be alarming for non stormer fans, cos thats some serious class depth they have and their should be no excuses for a coestzee to run his players to the ground, except if injuries should rear its ugly head.
its my understanding that deon fourie is not playing next year for the stormers, can anyone confirm this???
if he is playing, then i would start him at 6 straight away and bump kolisi to the bench with elsdtat to cover lock and i would then say the stormers and the chiefs who IMO will have SBW in 2013 will be hot favourites to take it out.

i cant wait for janties to prve everyone wrong next year and give me some more bragging rights, LMAO, :oP
 


sasuke uchiha

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 5864
RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 21:33:51

janties and taute will both thrive in the stormers enviroment, but im not too sure taute is going to replace de jong, i can only see it happening in a rotation or injury capacity.

i really think this stormers team has the goods to go all the way next year with janties and taute on board, for me the best thing about this team is the depth they have to cover all bases and hopefully in 2013, lady injury is a lot kinder to them then it was this year.

my stormers No1 team atm would have to be,,,
1 s kitshoff, 2 t liebenburg, 3 f malharbe, 4 e ezbeth, 5 a bekker, 6 s kolisi, 7 s burger, 8 d vermeulen, 9 d duvenage, 10 e janties, 11 g aplon, 12 JDV, 13 j de jong, 14 b habana, 15 j taute
16 s ntubeni, 17 p cilliers, 18  r botha, 19 r elsdtat, 20 n grrom, 21 p grant, 22 j pieterson

the number of class players not named in the 22 should be alarming for non stormer fans, cos thats some serious class depth they have and their should be no excuses for a coestzee to run his players to the ground, except if injuries should rear its ugly head.
its my understanding that deon fourie is not playing next year for the stormers, can anyone confirm this???
if he is playing, then i would start him at 6 straight away and bump kolisi to the bench with elsdtat to cover lock and i would then say the stormers and the chiefs who IMO will have SBW in 2013 will be hot favourites to take it out.

i cant wait for janties to prve everyone wrong next year and give me some more bragging rights, LMAO, :oP
 


Sharkbok

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 22:05:10

 @WPXV/Sasuke-

The Stormers squad looks fantastic. So much depth in most positions.

Some of them are even SuperXV standard is a few positions.

If they can now just get their backline to score some more tries they have to be one of the favourites.

They took first place on the log this year and if their backline attack improves they could take it to the next stage.  I think the performance of Jantjies will be critical. I think the Jurie is still out on his potential. No way he will match Grant on defence, but may give more attacking options

I am starting to think that it is Peter Grant that is killing the backline performance.

His passing in the semi final was so bad that they should have just used one of the cheerleaders shovel possesion down the backline

I thought that Deon Fourie had signed to go overseas? But I see now he has decided to stay.  

 


clevermike

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 30, 2012, 22:53:45

Sharkbok

Yes - I think Fourie was offered the Stormer captaincy and decided to stay put.   That poor backline performance was not entirely due to one player.  The fact is that the WP backline performed better without De Villiers and De Jongh in CC games than they did with them in the team. 

De Villiers used to be a good attacking center - but he went AWOL the past year and De Jongh has never been an attacking player at all.   The combination of Grant, De Villiers and De Jongh was fatal insofar as  attacking play is concerned.   Would Jantjies add anything  of value in that respect - I don't think so.  


Beeno1

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 31, 2012, 08:44:16

Mike please your cred i staking a knock here! You are overstating your case. Nothing wrong with jean tha tsome res twont cure. h ewill serve u swell next year and De Jong is also okay. What make you think the other guys will get no chance.

I would have preferred the Cat to Jantjes but I am hoping Jantjes can do a job for us. You forget Mike that Jantjes has plaeyed, is it, two season of Super 15 rugby fo the Lions at an acceptable standard. Hopefully Nieaber can work on his defence.

Of course I am assuming that ou Alistair has finally learnt that it is not a good thing to play his players into the ground. He seems at last to hav e twigged that we need a bit of attacking flair so it is reasonable to hope he can figure out that he needs to rotate his players. Frankly he has no excuse really as the squad has grea tdepth - apart from injuries happening  of course. Ohh tha twe had a real coach with intellectual ability like a Mallet or Rassie!!  However we do have experience and great quality in the squad so here is hoping we win the Super 15 next year!!


Beeno1

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 31, 2012, 08:53:50

WP15 welcome to the board!! Thanks for the summary and the details regarding age. Yes indeed ths is a fantastic squad and the youngsters will be even better next year. We have the experience and versatility as well.

Funny to hear Mike going on about how we are facing disaster because we have Jean, De Jongh and Jantjes in the squad!! Hahahahahahahahaha Mike gets these bees in his bonnet but to be fair is not the only one!


clevermike

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 31, 2012, 09:37:49

Beeno

The record speaks for itself.  The Stormers had serious injury problems - especially amongst the forwards - who was in fact the real key to prevention of tries being scored against them.  The Stormer forward pck really was the key to them being top of the log initially.

The failure was in their backline - with no bonus points for scoring tries - and the lowest number of tries scored by some distance.   From an attacking backline point of view a very poor record and that is where they failed ultimnately in the semi as well.   I merely said that the only real change they made is to bring in Jantjies and stuck with the two centers outside of him.   I also think the real jinx in attacking play is De Jongh - a player with an atrocious tryscoring record - 2 tries only in 2012.   Lets face facts - Dave is correct about De Jongh - he is far too small to be a decent attacking center at 87kgs.   As an example Jordaan is also on the short side - but weighs in at 96 kgs.   The opposition defence cannot do to Jordaan what they regulrly did in 2012 with De Jongh.   

If I was in the position to have a say in Stormer selection - I would say play Jantjies in the first three or four matches and continue with him only  if he shows any signs of life as an effective attacking flyhalf and does not collapse in defence.   I suspect he will not make the grade - but my suspicions is not what count here - his performances or lack of it will be the determining factor.   I would also play De Jongh at 13 for a few trial matches and if it is a repreat of his 2012 performances replace him with Du Plessis and/or Howard.    The latter will add considerable value to attacking play - which De Jongh is incapable of. 

There really is no other option than to play De Villiers at 12 - but he really is injury prone and at his age more fequent injuries will be more likely than not - and they may have to use De Allende in that position.  Will not detract from performances if they use that youngster in such an event.      

The point you made is that Jantjies played two full seasons for the Lions - the fact remained in those two seasons the Lions performed the worse of all Super 15 teams - and that with jantjies as the backline pivot.   No real plus in that case. 


carpetmuncher

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 31, 2012, 15:31:21

@mike spot on as always buddy

 

 


Arthur John

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Posts: 665
RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
October 31, 2012, 16:12:09

 Yes I am sure the other Coetzee (Sharks) is also excited about Jantjies joining the Stormers.

 

Crunch time coming up.


Beeno1

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RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
November 01, 2012, 08:41:09

Something for head in sand Mike and the muncher to "consider" - taken from article on our home page:

"Change in style: As the Stormers, the men from the Cape's game was based heavily on defence and this style didn't bring any success during this year's Super Rugby campaign. Coach Allister Coetzee had a rethink before the start of the Currie Cup campaign and opted to combine their defence orientated pattern with a more adventurous style of play.

Ou MIke and the Muncher haven't even noticed. Hahahahahahahhahahahahaha

Be advised Mike and Muncher the MIGHTY STORMERS WILL score bonus points this next Super 15 season  - you can count on it for sure!!!!

Wee sharki eCoetzee must work hard on conditioning so he can run with the big dogs. h emust also move to number 8 where his pace will be an asset . In fact I am liking the thought of a loose trio of Louw, Coetzee and Vermulen (7) which I hope Meyer will try on tour.

 


clevermike

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Posts: 13133
RE: Coetzee excited about Jantjes and Taute joining Stormers
November 01, 2012, 09:29:33

Beeno

I wish the Stormers well in scoring more tries and collecting bonus points in the process in Super 15 next year.   I also support what Coetzee said in the relevant regard and hope it comes to the fore in actual play.

However, to achieve that objective you also need the players to perform.   I have dealt with the capacity of the Stormers backline and specifically De Jongh's capacity as an attacking force elsewhere and gave specific instances to illustrate the problems with De Jongh.      I also said De Jongh on his own is not the only problem insofar as attacking backline play is concerned - but he definitely is a major one.

Has it never entered your mind that the WP backline without De Villiers and De Jongh in fact functioned better as an attacking backline unit than they did when the two players mentioned are in fact in the team..   Does that not tell you something?   I am not the ostrich and in this cae  I think in fact you are.   

As to Jantjies I am not sure at all about whether he will really add value to attacking backline play by the Stormers.   He played in the weak Lions team and was not really a generator of attacking play at all.   Jantjies definitely stands too deep in the pocket and I am in agreement with Stranski when he said his passing game is manufactured.   Please note that when De Jongh scored that try in the final Catrakilis was much flatter than Jantjies playing his normal game would have been - consequently the pass to the Jongh was much less readable than the deeper standing Jantjies would have achieved under similar cir[removed]stances.   When jantjies standing deeper in the Lions game - tried the same type of pass frequently -  the effect was really negative - leading to nothing.    

Please go and watch Jantjies again in games played and you will notice what i said is based on fact - not fiction.       


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