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1708 Topic: Top batsmen of all time
Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
Top batsmen of all time
July 22, 2012, 13:15:22

Leading Test batting averages ranked in order of average

(Source: Cricinfo Statsguru 17 July 2012)

Rank Batsman Tests Innings N.O. Runs Highest Ave[5] Career dates
1 Australia D. G. Bradman 52 80 10 6996 334 99.94 1928–1948
2 South Africa R. G. Pollock 23 41 4 2256 274 60.97 1963–1970
3 Jamaica G. A. Headley 22 40 4 2190 270* 60.83 1930–1954
4 England H. Sutcliffe 54 84 9 4555 194 60.73 1924–1935
5 England E. Paynter 20 31 5 1540 243 59.23 1931–1939
6 England K. F. Barrington 82 131 15 6806 256 58.67 1955–1968
7 Barbados E.D. Weekes 48 81 5 4455 207 58.61 1948–1958
8 England W. R. Hammond 85 140 16 7249 336* 58.45 1927–1947
9 Barbados G. S. Sobers 93 160 21 8032 365* 57.78 1954–1974
10 England J.B.Hobbs 61 102 7 5410 211 56.95 1908–1930


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 22, 2012, 13:21:07

Kallis with this innings should make it onto the list. Add his bowling and billiant slip fileding and his only rival for the greatest ever is Bradman.

Say Kallis has an average now of 57. Means bradman is 42 to the good. Would you have a batsmen with average of 42 or a bowler like Kallis - at his best a front line bowler, Sobers I might add was not in the class of kallis as a bowler.

No other two players come close to these two.


flashdakota

Status: Squad member
Posts: 320
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 22, 2012, 17:33:06

 Wtf is with those flags???

Old SA flag and Jamaican flag???

 


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 22, 2012, 18:43:37

I think I copied this from Wiks but not sure where as I looked at a number of sites. weird really.


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 23, 2012, 08:23:38

 I would rate Sir don as the greatest batsman of all time. But Pollock we wil never really know has he never had enough exposure at top level.

Greates cricketers of all time. Would be a coin toss between King Kallis and Sir Garfield Sobers. I tend to go fo King Kallis out of Biased, and I am not ashamed to say this. So the greatest Cricket player of all time is Kallis. I would not consider him as the greatest batsman, neither as the greatest bowler. he falls in a different catagory altogether. Sobers and Kallis where/are two in millions no one is in their league.

Pollock played under the old system. He does not count with the numbers since reunification, so yes he will have the old flag. headley played for West Indies, but his country is Jamaica so yes Jamaican flag for him, what is the problem with that.?Same as Barbados flag for Sobers et al. if Kallis gets on the list he played under the new adminstration so he will get a new flag. 


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 23, 2012, 13:10:15

Bradman must rank as the best bat of all time by some way. Pollock would never have been close to a 100 average. An average like that is inhuman!

Kallis was a better bowler than Sobers by a definite margin and their batting was comparable average wise. Hence Kallis is better and no bias is needed. To me its out of Bradman and Kallis.

What is hugely surprising is the lack of recognition that comes Jaque's way.  Have you ever heard of anyone suggesting Kallis could be the greatest ever? 


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 23, 2012, 13:29:44

 Yes me. :)

But i have and will never suggest that Kallis is the best Batsman ever, because he isn't.

The best cricketer (ie. all rounder) ever, yes.

Best batsman:

I would rate: Bradman, Jack Hobbs, Wally Hammond, Sachin Tendulkar, Sunil Gavaskar, Ricky Ponting, Brian Lara, Barry Richards, Greame Pollock (not neccesrily in order).

Kallis not on the same list as he is not a batsman alone. Kallis, Viv Richards, Garfield Sobers have alist of their own.

Then Bowlers: Steyn has a good chance to be on such a list one day when his career comes to an end. but not yet. Malcolm Marshall, Dennis Lillee, Shane Warne, Muthai Mauralitharan and ontother load of West Indian fast Bowlers.

But there are 3 guys i will never leave out of a World VI : Kallis, Richards and Sobers. As they bring so much more than just batting to the party. 


Denny

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1634
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 25, 2012, 12:36:51

Problem I have when rating  JK is his category....Batsman or allrounder??????


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Top batsmen of all time
July 25, 2012, 12:43:03

 Batting all rounder, and the greates ever. Not that difficult Denny :)


Arthur John

Status: Squad member
Posts: 597
RE: Top batsmen of all time
October 04, 2012, 00:46:34

 Another SA player not mentioned...a guy who performed well with both bat and ball was...

EDDIE BARLOW.

Do you guys recall him at all?

Other great batsman were:

Dennis Lindsay(? not sure of the spelling),Roy McLean, Lee Irvine,Trevor Goddard,Jackie McGlew,John Waite, John Bland and a few others from more recent times...

Also remember that Gary Sobers is the only player who ever hit all the balls bowled in one over for sixes. Those were the days of 8 ball overs. So he scored 48 runs in one over.

Never has been repeated even in the 6 ball era by any player in first class cricket. 

Old stats but a relevant fact when comparing players from today and yesterday.

I personally don't like rating any player the best of all time simply because we as humans tend to forget the older guys and their achievements of yesterday.

Trust this does not reveal my age group.

Cheers guys.


Beeno1

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10904
RE: Top batsmen of all time
October 05, 2012, 08:56:28

AJ I certainly rate Eddie barlow as he was a match winner. He was also a very astute captain. As for age its afflicts us all.

To me when you consider who was the greatest cricketer you have to think about who added the overall greatest value to a side. On that basis its between Bradman and Kallis surely.


Chippo

Status: Squad member
Posts: 514
RE: Top batsmen of all time
October 06, 2012, 02:27:23

Great debate going on here! But its such a contentious issue.

THere are so many factors to take into consideration.

  1. Player era
  2. Players stats
  3. Who the player played against (very NB)
  4. What kind of a team was the player in (ie: Did the team rely heavily on him)
  5. Equipment used
  6. Wjat situation they scored most of their runs (ala G Smith who lovees scoring in the 4th innings.... what a champ!!)

 

So with all these factors taken into consideration, this debate could go on forever!

One needs to remember that a guy like Ricky Ponting and Mat Hayden may not have had such high averages had they had to play against Warne, McGrath and co...

Similarly, D Cullinan may have averaged closer to 60 had he played alongside Warne and McGrath.

 

I'd like to see who D Bradman was up against during his era? Were there any steam train bowlers that he had to face?

 

In my humble opinion BC Lara was always up against it. He played in a really shit side and he was constantly targeted. To come out with such a magnificent record at a time when Warne, MCGrath, Donald, Murali and Waqar and Wasim were in their pomp, is no mean feat.


Arthur John

Status: Squad member
Posts: 597
RE: Top batsmen of all time
October 07, 2012, 16:22:35

 Chippo....you make an excellent point/points.


Ek

Status: Bok regular
Posts: 1464
RE: Top batsmen of all time
October 10, 2012, 09:16:55

 Chippo i don't thinl anyone can argue with any of those points you made.

So normally we leave the perception we have of players along the side as you say it is contentious. Thus we then rely on the old stats to make the decision for us. Now these stats are as accurate a measurement as we are going to get, but nothing will be able to teall you the true story, that unfortunately is a fact that we have to accept.


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